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Snuffy
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Joined: 28 Dec 2012
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Location: Everett, WA |
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Snuffy
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 Tue Aug 11, 2020 1:38 pm |
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You don't find yourself standing at the top of a mountain without having started out in the valley.
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markweth
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Joined: 08 Feb 2017
Posts: 155 | TRs | Pics
Location: Montana |
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markweth
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Tue Aug 11, 2020 1:52 pm |
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I doubt anyone is going to "petition the Seattle Times", but I do think it is unprofessional of them to not mention Leave No Trace or minimal impact camping anywhere in that story (at least as far as I could tell -- nothing about not camping in meadows, pack it in/pack it out, not camping too close to water sources, respecting wildlife/other visitors, etc.). I think criticizing them for that is valid.
I also think that a story about how to read maps and research on one's own would be much more interesting and of more value to readers than re-hashing a trip that has been covered in guidebooks and popular for decades.
There is some nuance to these discussions, it's not all "no info" or "share everything" . . .
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Ski
><((((°>
Joined: 28 May 2005
Posts: 12835 | TRs | Pics
Location: tacoma |
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Ski
><((((°>
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Tue Aug 11, 2020 2:39 pm |
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The author of the Seattle Times piece is simply telling a story about his own personal experience of a place.
It is not incumbent upon the author to also lecture the reader about "leave no trace" ethics, or how to park their car, or that they should have their dog on a tether, or any number of other things people here are bitching about.
Would you expect the writer of a piece about travelling in their car to also include information about making sure there's a litter bag in the car, or how to change a flat tire, or to be sure to check all the belts and hoses under the hood before a long journey?
Y'all need to get out more and go find places that are not overrun by morons with "Bluetooth" speakers, dogs, and fans of Logan Paul, and stop whining about "social media".
"I shall wear white flannel trousers, and walk upon the beach.
I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each."
"I shall wear white flannel trousers, and walk upon the beach.
I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each."
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Kim Brown
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Joined: 13 Jul 2009
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Yes, any media outlet in Puget Sound should certainly include LNT ethics along with a hiking feature.
This is a big, hot issue in Puget Sound, so yeah, including more information would be prudent.
Ski, the morons have indeed infiltrated some very, very out-of-the-way places, and have overrun and ruined them. Parties, fire rings, noise...
Seattle Times has dropped the ball.
"..living on the east side of the Sierra world be ideal - except for harsher winters and the chance of apocalyptic fires burning the whole area."
Bosterson, NWHiker's marketing expert
"..living on the east side of the Sierra world be ideal - except for harsher winters and the chance of apocalyptic fires burning the whole area."
Bosterson, NWHiker's marketing expert
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Cyclopath
Faster than light
Joined: 20 Mar 2012
Posts: 7754 | TRs | Pics
Location: Seattle |
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Cyclopath
Faster than light
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Tue Aug 11, 2020 2:57 pm |
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There are currently 27 national monuments "under review" with an eye toward removing protections for public lands, and in some cases opening up the mineral rights.
Recent legislation takes an aim at selling off public lands.
A lot of roads we use to access beloved trails are being closed.
Maintenance backlogs are insane, and will only get worse as wildfire takes up more and more of the budget.
Etc.
How does the hiking community respond to these and other threats? Divide ourselves, try to prevent people from sharing photos from their hikes. Complain that there are too many hikers.  Denigrate people who enjoy the mountains for the 'wrong' reasons ("instagram hikers").
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Cyclopath
Faster than light
Joined: 20 Mar 2012
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Location: Seattle |
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Cyclopath
Faster than light
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Tue Aug 11, 2020 3:00 pm |
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| Kim Brown wrote: | | Yes, any media outlet in Puget Sound should certainly include LNT ethics along with a hiking feature.
This is a big, hot issue in Puget Sound, so yeah, including more information would be prudent.
Ski, the morons have indeed infiltrated some very, very out-of-the-way places, and have overrun and ruined them. Parties, fire rings, noise...
Seattle Times has dropped the ball. |
Surely you don't think the woods are being trashed because too many kids these days read the newspaper? 
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Snuffy
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Joined: 28 Dec 2012
Posts: 315 | TRs | Pics
Location: Everett, WA |
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Snuffy
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Tue Aug 11, 2020 3:06 pm |
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| markweth wrote: | | There is some nuance to these discussions, it's not all "no info" or "share everything" . . . |
The petition, the reason for this thread, is an all-or-nothing ban on geotagging. It is also a petition to target just one of many outlets that are sharing hike locations, the reason for my post about the Seattle Times, which has a much larger audience than WHC and has shared many outdoor locations over the years.
I agree it is a nuanced issue, but this petition is not.
You don't find yourself standing at the top of a mountain without having started out in the valley.
You don't find yourself standing at the top of a mountain without having started out in the valley.
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Tom
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Joined: 15 Dec 2001
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Tom
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Tue Aug 11, 2020 3:09 pm |
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Cyclopath, seems an extreme vs. removing geotag info. Like markweth said there's some nuance here. I don't think geotagging needs to be banned, but there are ways to mitigate impacts that aren't at odds with support for public lands.
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RumiDude
Marmota olympus
Joined: 26 Jul 2009
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Location: Port Angeles |
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RumiDude
Marmota olympus
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Tue Aug 11, 2020 3:10 pm |
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| markweth wrote: | |
I doubt anyone is going to "petition the Seattle Times", but I do think it is unprofessional of them to not mention Leave No Trace or minimal impact camping anywhere in that story (at least as far as I could tell -- nothing about not camping in meadows, pack it in/pack it out, not camping too close to water sources, respecting wildlife/other visitors, etc.). I think criticizing them for that is valid. |
Nope, that is not valid criticism. It's just one single article about an individual's experience. The Seattle Times doesn't have to do the LNT mantra everytime anything outdoors is mentioned. In the same vein, they don't have to remind people to buckle their seatbelts, check the tire pressure, and top off engine fluids every story about a road trip.| markweth wrote: | | I also think that a story about how to read maps and research on one's own would be much more interesting and of more value to readers than re-hashing a trip that has been covered in guidebooks and popular for decades. |
You do know they have covered those topics in the past, don't you?
Rumi
"This is my Indian summer ... I'm far more dangerous now, because I don't care at all."
"This is my Indian summer ... I'm far more dangerous now, because I don't care at all."
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Tom
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Joined: 15 Dec 2001
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Tom
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Tue Aug 11, 2020 3:14 pm |
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| Snuffy wrote: | | the Seattle Times, which has a much larger audience than WHC |
Seattle Times may have half a million readers but not necessarily all are hikers. I would venture to guess WHC might have more impact on a particular destination than a Seattle Times article.
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Kim Brown
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Joined: 13 Jul 2009
Posts: 6900 | TRs | Pics
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| Cyclopath wrote: | | Surely you don't think the woods are being trashed because too many kids these days read the newspaper? |
 Good point.
"..living on the east side of the Sierra world be ideal - except for harsher winters and the chance of apocalyptic fires burning the whole area."
Bosterson, NWHiker's marketing expert
"..living on the east side of the Sierra world be ideal - except for harsher winters and the chance of apocalyptic fires burning the whole area."
Bosterson, NWHiker's marketing expert
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Kim Brown
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Joined: 13 Jul 2009
Posts: 6900 | TRs | Pics
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| RumiDude wrote: | | You do know they have covered those topics in the past, don't you? |
So who is going to read an article today and then go do some research in the publication's archives for LNT, how to hike, how to read a map - even if they don't understand any of these concepts or phrases, let alone going the extra steps to find information on them. It's best to cover it ad nauseum with each article.
Reminds me of a time I suggested LNT information in a publication and those responsible said, "well we covered that in a blog 2 weeks ago." Right, that's useful today.
"..living on the east side of the Sierra world be ideal - except for harsher winters and the chance of apocalyptic fires burning the whole area."
Bosterson, NWHiker's marketing expert
"..living on the east side of the Sierra world be ideal - except for harsher winters and the chance of apocalyptic fires burning the whole area."
Bosterson, NWHiker's marketing expert
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RumiDude
Marmota olympus
Joined: 26 Jul 2009
Posts: 3596 | TRs | Pics
Location: Port Angeles |
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RumiDude
Marmota olympus
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Tue Aug 11, 2020 3:46 pm |
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| Kim Brown wrote: | | RumiDude wrote: | | You do know they have covered those topics in the past, don't you? |
So who is going to read an article today and then go do some research in the publication's archives for LNT, how to hike, how to read a map - even if they don't understand any of these concepts or phrases, let alone going the extra steps to find information on them. It's best to cover it ad nauseum with each article. |
In the first place, they can't cover it ad nauseum with each article about the outdoors. It just can't be done, period.
Secondly, it's like putting up photos/notes/etc on the refrigerator to remind or inspire oneself, after a few views they stop having an effect.
Rumi
"This is my Indian summer ... I'm far more dangerous now, because I don't care at all."
"This is my Indian summer ... I'm far more dangerous now, because I don't care at all."
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seattlenativemike
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Joined: 06 Oct 2012
Posts: 524 | TRs | Pics
Location: seattle |
| Cyclopath wrote: | | Surely you don't think the woods are being trashed because too many kids these days read the newspaper? |
Awesome...great point
Its funny us "adults" debating all this and our means of communicating the solution/message to the kids isn't even on their radar. Maybe make a TikTok video or convince the latest/greatest pop star who can't sing to come up with a jingle.
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Kim Brown
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Joined: 13 Jul 2009
Posts: 6900 | TRs | Pics
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| RumiDude wrote: | | In the first place, they can't cover it ad nauseum with each article about the outdoors. It just can't be done, period. |
Sure they can.
They don't need to write a new dissertation with each article. All they have to do is toss in one sentence and link to The Mountaineers, or WTA, or any other NFP who has resources at the ready.
Education is worth a sentence or two.
"..living on the east side of the Sierra world be ideal - except for harsher winters and the chance of apocalyptic fires burning the whole area."
Bosterson, NWHiker's marketing expert
"..living on the east side of the Sierra world be ideal - except for harsher winters and the chance of apocalyptic fires burning the whole area."
Bosterson, NWHiker's marketing expert
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