[sambisu]

So my wife and I are hoping to do the Wonderland Trail this summer (end of July/beginning of August) and I was hoping to pick up some tips on getting a permit. From what I've read so far, it sounds like a lot of people get denied. We are very flexible on start dates and itineraries. Am I best off just submitting one request that just indicates we will accept alternate sites and start dates? Because we would also be okay changing trailheads, number of total days (would like to do 10-12), travel direction, etc. Or should I submit multiple requests? The form has a spot to put Choice #, but I didn't see any direction on submitting multiple choices. Do I just put multiple forms together and still just pay the reservation fee once? Also, we would like to put together a few back-up ideas for trips in WA. If we don't get the permit, I would still probably go and try to get walk-up permit. But since we are coming from Iowa I would like to have a plan B (and possibly C). So any recommendations on 1-2 week backpacking trips in the vicinity of any of the National Parks in Washington? Would definitely prefer a loop. Thanks!

[yaki]

Being so flexible you should be OK but I would be inclined to have your wife submit a request too. Mark everything you can you note your flexibility. I'd probably send the wife's permit request in a week later just so you're in different places in the stack. Good luck! You're going to love it. The WT is even better than you can imagine.

[yaki]

Also, if you haven't gotten your fill of WT research you can check my TR for a review of our trip in 2010.

[hes]

In addition to whatever people suggest here, the _Backpacking Washington_ book by Craig Romano is good source for reading about other multi-day options: http://www.amazon.com/Backpacking-Washington-Overnight-Multi-Day-Routes/dp/1594851107/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1361991541&sr=8-1&keywords=backpacking+washington Something in the Olympics would be good choice for weeklong trek. Trail network there has lots of interconnections so easy to build loops. At least if snow is not an issue in the high passes, which should be okay in late July. You could also do a long section hike along Pacific Crest Trail, although that would more likely be point-to-point and snow could be (?) more of an issue.

[williswall]

This same question comes up every year. Worst case, even if you don't get a permit you are likely to be able to create an itinerary via walk up, or change your permitted itinerary to one that better suits you.

[sambisu]

[AlpineRose]

Same answer to the same question. The WT lottery really is a lottery. It doesn't matter when during the lottery period you mail in your application(s). If your application is selected towards the end of the drawing, your chance of getting a permit is almost nil, regardless of what you have specified in terms of flexibility. You will be notified of either success or failure in mid-April, giving you plenty of time to choose another destination. Or decide to take your chances on snagging a walk-up WT permit.

[williswall]

Here's an example. Last year I was contacted by someone in Australia, who was unable to get the permits with the March application. She was ready to bag her trip but I encouraged her to come anyway and go for the walk up permits....the park keeps about 30 percent of the available space in reserve. She made the trip, got the exact campsites she wanted, and I even ran into her on the trail....she was extremely glad she took the chance and came anyway and had a wonderful trip. I was on the trail a lot this past year and talked to a number of people who had no problems getting the campsites they wanted on a walk up basis. I have never had a problem getting permits (walk up) over the course of 30 years, including cross country permits. It's great to have backup plans, but based on my experience it is highly unlikely that someone is not going to be able to put together a satisfactory itinerary doing walk ups.

[yaki]

If WT doesn't work out consider PCT from Stevens Pass to Snoqualmie about the 2nd week of August. I think it's around 75 miles.

[sambisu]

[Adohrn]

1. Last year the Rangers had 1200 (800 on a normal year) permits on their desk the first day they started processing them. The first 200 go through easily. After that it gets much harder. Around 400 they almost start denying them wholesale. The rangers recognize names from previous years that have yet to get their trip. 2. Send in a lot of alternate Itinerarys. Number them 1-whatever. The actual permit costs $20 not the requests. The Rangers processing the permits are likely to be overwhelmed so don’t expect them to get overly creative making up a trip for you. They don’t know your capabilities or if you will show up if you don’t get your perfect trip. Help them out. 3. The first bottle neck that will stop you from getting permit are the Summerland and Indian River campsites. After around 300-400 permits are processed there are generally no open spots left in August. There is a reason for that as this is a truly spectacular piece of trail. Hope to get them but plan for the worst. Plan B Have alternative Itinerarys having you camp at only 1 of these sites instead of both. Plan C. If you are young enough and strong enough, or an ultralighter you can have alternate Itinerary that shoots you past them (White River campround to Nickle Creek campsite). Look really hard at the elevation gains and losses and distances involved since this is a really bad option for the I think I’am in halfway decent shape hiker. Plan D. Use the Owyhigh lakes trail as a bypass. It starts at White River campground and and reenters the Wonderland trail at Nickel Creek. Deer Creek and Olallie Creek are potential campsites to stay at. Just because you get your permit using the bypass doesn’t mean that they won’t reroute you back onto the Wonderland trail space permitting. Between no shows and the 30 percent of the campsites being left open for walkups means you have a pretty good chance of getting back on the trail. Worked for me last summer. 4. Distance and Elevation Map of the trail. http://www.nps.gov/mora/planyourvisit/loader.cfm?csModule=security/getfile&PageID=433680 5. The second bottle neck is Klapatche Park Campground and Golden Lakes. This one is nowhere near as bad as you can create multiple alternative Itinerarys using Devils Dream , South and North Puyallup River campsites and well as South Mowich River. Make sure to get creative and send in all the different possibilities that your capable of doing. If you get past these two bottle necks your very likely to get your trip as the Ranger will most likely be able finagle camp sites for the rest of the trial. Make sure to check that you will accept alternative campsites on the form. 6. Word of warning North Puyallup River campsite is on an old road bed. Don’t expect to easily be driving your tent stakes in. I was forced to tie the guy lines for my tarp to rocks. 7. Now for the More Generic advice 8. Send in Itinerary starting at different places. Longmire, Sunrise, Mowich Lake are all safe places to leave a car. Longmire and Sunrise both are next to ranger stations. While Mowich Lake has only a Ranger patrol cabin it’s a busy walk in camp site with people walking by where the cars are parked all day a night. I felt really comfortable leaving my car there. Its at the end of a well maintained if dusty gravel road. 9. Most People start at Longmire. Arguably its probably the worst place to start. Lots of uphill and strenuous first days. The trail between Nickle Creek and Longmire while beautiful is a bit of a let down after the areas between Summerland and Indian Bar. Better to end your trip on a High at Mowich Lake or Sunrise. 10. Have trips going clockwise as well as counterclockwise. It will seem less busy going clockwise and you will see the same people more often. Going counterclockwise means you will see almost everyone but only once. Fewer people go counterclockwise so it has the potential to put you off sink with the herd. 11. Start your trip on a weekday not weekend. 12. Give as wide a window as possible for start dates for your trip. 13. Don’t get fixated on a set duration. If you want to do it in 12 days ship in a 10,11,13 and 14 day ittenary as well. Its very likely you could avoid a bottle neck by doing this and get your trip. If the ranger knows your fit enough to do the trail is less days he will also be more willing to finesse things. Might be smart to send in an additional note telling them what mileage as well as elevation gain and loss your comfortable doing in a given day. 14. So you get a trip, but its not your dream trip. Its not that hard to adjust your Itinerary once on the trail. It can be done a day before your planned trip, At any ranger station you hit during your trip, Or any Ranger you meet on the trail they will radio it in. 15. Don’t knock the walk up trips. The boards in the ranger stations show an amazing number of open campsites on any given day. Meet people on the trail last summer that got their perfect trip by just showing up. The fewer days you can do the trail in the more likely your will get the full Wonderland trail. 16. August is a really hard month to get a trip. Late July and Early September permits are more likely to be successful. 17. Faxing in your permits can be a little dangerous. Last year the fax machine glitched loosing a number of people’s applications. They didn’t get their trips. They truly don’t start processing permits early. So sending yours in by mail won’t hurt your chances. At the very least the likely hood of the overworked fax machine dying on the first day or after hours when no one is watching will be the highest. 18. To be brutally honest the campsites are all pretty much the same so don’t get excited about which ones you get. In a few years the trail is what you will remember vividly not the campsites. The only exception to this would be Summerland mainly because it would be spectacular to be there in the morning light. I missed out. 19. Get and use sawyer bug repellent permethrin (One time spray on the cloths). With it I had no problem with mosquitoes even at Devils Dream (it definitely does have a mosquito problem) where others were forced to take shelter in their tents.

[doublemom]

Friends and I had a permit for the whole loop last August, but we ended up having to come off the trail half-way because of some health issues. 2 of us waited a week, then finished the other half by getting a walk-in permit. We couldn't get Klapatche, which we were kind of bummed about, but we were able to hang out there for several hours and had lunch there before moving on to the next camp. Other than not getting that one campground, we had absolutely no trouble at all getting a 4-night permit as a walk-in to finish the loop.

[doublemom]

And ditto on the permethrin... the mosquitoes can be fierce, especially on the west side of the Mountain. I'm a mosquito magnet, people like hiking with me because I'm the decoy for the entire campground. Even with treating all clothes and tent with permethrin, and using huge amounts of DEET, I still donated a large quantity of blood to those little vampires. But... everyone hiking with me was fine, it was just MY blood they wanted

[PorcupinePhobia]

Can you get a walk-up permit from any of the ranger stations, or does it have to be at Longmire?

[doublemom]

Any... I got my permit at the Carbon River station the day before and started hiking from Longmire the next day. You can get a walk-in permit the day before you want to start hiking, as soon as the ranger station is open in the morning.